Did Yoko love John? | Page 19 | Fab Forum | The Beatles Bible

Expert Textpert said
I wouldn’t say she brought out his worst. Imagine , Woman and Oh, Yoko! are some of his best songs and he owes them to her. She also co-wrote Give Peace A Chance and Julia .

Yoko was not the only one interested in the occult. When they needed to stock up the Cold Spring Harbor house with books, John purchased tons of books from the new age book store. He was very excited about reading H. P. Blavatsky.

John was thin because of his macrobiotic diet, which was his choice. He wasn’t a prisoner. He came and went as he pleased.

And Julian and the other Beatles visited the Dakota. 

As to Yoko having affairs, John knew and didn’t care because he had done the same.

It looks like someone has been reading slanted material written by Yoko haters. I’ve read some of it, too.

Thanks @Expert Textpert, I agree that Yoko did give John lots of inspirations in their first few years, say 68-72.

For the occult thing, it is one thing to devote into it, it is another thing to use occult to manipulate other people, e.g., Yoko instructed John Green (the tarot reader) to tell John Lennon what she wanted Lennon to do. And I believe too much occult brings bad karma. 

The affair thing, they were sort of in an open relationship but I think it is quite unfair that Yoko moved on leaving John stuck in deep depression in a Gothic building… 

Regarding Yoko’s attitude to Julian and other relatives,  no words….Maybe our opinions are too different to have a good discussion on this.

I  am sorry it took me so long to reply……The idea about John having a tragic life is depressing, I don’t really want to think about his later years and death, it is quite disturbing, quite sad……so maybe I will just end it here. But thanks for the discussion! 

ps: Thank you @P3pperish for the kind words, I love this forum a lot! 

Expert Textpert said
The fact is you have chosen which version of the story to believe because of your biases, which are backed up by second hand stories of which there are conflicting accounts.

There is never first hand stories, because the one (John) who was able to provide first hand stories was dead, and Yoko has a conflict of interest. We are all biased and back ourselves up by second hand stories, but it is not that I chose to believe something, I hate to believe what I am believing, but I had my research done, compared multiple sources and sadly my rational judgement led me to this current conclusion.

Expert Textpert said
And my rational judgment and research led me to my conclusion: that Yoko is willful, independent, a little selfish and likes to tell her own version of the truth. She’s a female John Lennon . They were made for each other.

I actually agree with you: Yoko is a very strong person. She is motivated, independent, determined, tends to be very protective, demanding and somewhat selfish. Having that said, she’s much more a female Paul McCartney than a female John Lennon . Yes maybe Yoko was made for John, but Yoko doesn’t need John to that same degree, she is good with or without him (perhaps even better off), just like Paul. 

I think John Lennon knew best what he wanted, and he did love Yoko. But this relationship wasn’t the typical male-female romantic affair. I have a strong feeling about his homosexual leanings. I have read through all his writings, from In His Own Words to Skywriting by Word of Mouth, except for Ballad of John/Yoko and two stories which he mentioned about his first lover Barbara Baker and some princess (apparently Yoko but wasn’t the central figure), there was very few…maybe none…..real female figures in these stories, although many of them were either his sexual fantasies or something autographical. Talking about his relationship with Yoko, John also made comments like “it is just handy to f**k your best friend, once I addressed the problem that now my best friend is a female, there is no restriction”, and “the reason I love you (Yoko) is because you look like a bloke in a drag” etc. Also judging from his songs, his comments about “no attractive women can arouse me to a certain degree” etc, it seems to me John was not naturally attracted to women. In fact, Yoko basically pursued (stalked?) John for more than a year before he turned to her. 

All these make me believe John fell for Yoko for a different reason than romantic attraction. He admired her mentality, he looked up to her for spiritual direction (like a guru) and comfort – She was like a fix to him which turned up at a right time, after John drifted apart from Paul and got lost/bored, at first it was like his other temporary infatuations: stu, beatlemania, LSD, magic alex, India guru thing, etc. Then Yoko became like a combination of mother/guru/heroine provider figure to John, and she also took care of him.  

Their relationship shares some similarity with the one between French female writer Marguerite Duras with her gay lover Yann (40 years younger), or between a famous Chinese poet Gu Cheng and his mother/nanny-like wife (he lived together with another lover). Both lack of basic living skills, their spouses relied on them emotionally and took care of them, but the core of the relationship was not romantic attractions in a physical way.

But in Yoko’s case, John relied on her emotionally but needed her care at the same time. This became increasingly unbalanced in the late years, 1975-1980, when Yoko gradually lost her attractions to the reclusive/depressed/maniac John, and perhaps was even bothered by his mental problems and emotional need, that’s why I thought she did not love him – later on she didn’t need him (other than his money and him as Sean’s father), neither emotionally, physically nor business-wise or work-wise (pls forgive my poor English). In a way, Paul needed John much more than Yoko, given their early experiences and how well they worked together. 

I am just thinking, maybe Yoko had a even stronger bond with Sam Havadtoy (her next bf), because he stepped in when she was at her weakest, that made a great difference. According to Paul and others, this Havadtoy guy supported Yoko’s life and business, and strongly influenced her thoughts, they two acted together to manage their stuffs, so their relationship was more balanced and, perhaps, more long-lasting.