We Can Work It Out - Politics & Philosophy | Page 74 | Fab Forum | The Beatles Bible

Thanks, Holey, for bringing up the topic.  Bit waste of time endlessly arguing about Trump.

There are reasons to stay optimistic about the Hong Kong protests. The citizens are brave, and have developed their own strategy against the police. Technically, destroying HK’s autonomy status brings no good to CCP, for they need it as an international financial center to look after their own interests. However, given the threatening figure of the current Chinese authority, I’m literally afraid that they won’t care about the consequences and use military crackdown to strengthen their rule(and it happened before). It seems that the government still shows no intention of direct confrontation to HK people’s demands, understandable considering democratic reform is included.

Personally speaking, I feel frustrated, even bit of desperate seeing people following propaganda against the HK protests every day. The CCP is going to extremes, in its autonomous districts, also against Hong Kong and Taiwan.

I didn’t say Trump’s comments were meant comically……Forget Trump if you can with regards to what I’ve been trying to illustrate.

My point throughout has been that words alone especially when contrary to the hard evidence do not necessarily a racist make.

As for Hong Kong….(Fragrant Harbour)…..

The Chinese recently found and destroyed 10,000 maps purely because Taiwan was drawn on them. They are playing the long game as thoroughly as they can. They already have tremendous clout in Washington with Dems and Reps in their pocket… Hollywood, even to insisting on removal of some of the stickers on Tom Cruise’s new Top Gun leather jacket…..(That’s thorough) and silicon valley……Stealing what they can and encouraging American AI companies to start up in China partnered with a Chinese company who eventually will replace them.   Increasingly their Confucius centres set up openly in America’s top universities are doing sterling  work on behalf of the Chinese government. The US is basically an innovation economy if the US can’t profit from its inventions it hasn’t got an economy.

Since they entered the World Trade organisation on tremendously favourable conditions which even then they’ve not seriously tried to conform with..They traded with the world (particularly with the US)  with tremendous one-sided advantages.

However your current President has been banging on about this issue for 20 years and is using the levers he posses to reign China in. People get this wrong…The US hasn’t started a trade war…….It’s belatedly entered into it. China has been unashamedly battering away at the US for decades..And the US never punched back.

US pressure is making China’s pips squeak they are hanging on hoping that Biden preferably, but anyone will replace in 2020 the only President that has ever  fought back.

The US has advantages that nullify China’s…….China own US bonds by the billions but selling them all off makes them worthless and affects their own currency, while the dollar is the world’s reserve currency

…………..China owns all the world’s rare earths……They supply the world cheaply but raising the price or reducing production will mean that the US will then find it financially viable to dig out and extract them from more difficult sources…..(Also President XI’s family own the rare earths business and he would take a personal hit).

China is growing its muscle …….Not only the South China Sea but in lending the money to countries that can’t pay them back and building ports and roads with Chinese companies that they then take 99 year leases out on and effectively they become parts of China.

The South China Sea issue is causing Japan to re-think the parameters of its defence forces and they would certainly be a formidable enemy in any hot conflict……Unfortunately South Korea and Japan are at each others throats and that’s to China’s advantage.

The only effective check to China’s coercion remains the US and a President that won’t be intimidated.

As for Hong Kong..Slowly slowly China catches monkey 

You’re having a laugh……The Democrats only card left to play is the race card….They are stoking division for all it’s worth.

I suggest you read my other posts on this subject……I’m always able to back up my opinions or I wouldn’t hold them.

I’d assumed you’d taken note of the Dem’s tactics which have been from the outset to attack Trump not his policies. I’ll come to that again latter.

I’m sure you’ll know all this

A potted history, (from memory) of the playing of the race card in the US.

For at least the century before 1968 and Johnson’s Civil Rights Act both parties have played the race card. From the Civil War until 1968 it was the Dems. In 1922 I recall reading how Dem operatives tried to smear W Harding by saying he had black forbears……It didn’t work.

The Reps, the party of Lincoln were traditionally more open to the black voters. For decades the Dems dominated the southern states and produced some of the most repulsive racists such as the unforgettable Senator Bilbo an open KKK member….Even Roosevelt felt he had to oppose an anti-lynching law because he was scared he’d lose the Southern states.

It wasn’t until George Wallace stood so successfully as an Independent that the Souther States were taken away from the Dems and the presidency was handed to Nixon who went on and played the race card himself……

Eventually the party of Lincoln decided the only way it could avoid defeat after defeat was to abandon its principles. Reagans’ first speech was in support of the ‘State’s Rights’ speech a coded message to Southern voters we have your interests at heart.  

I won’t go on…..Point is both parties have done it and do it. Pointing the finger at Trump and the Dems are pointing three fingers back at themselves…..

Since the demise of Stormy Stormy and Russia Russia the Dems have gone for the race card all out.

Trump undoubtably plays to his base the forgotten and tired of being despised ‘deplorables who cling to their guns and the bible’ The contempt of the elites on the West and East coast smacks of a new class war. They’ve had enough…Trump’s message goes down well with them. Can some of his words be construed as racist? Obviously they can by those that want to see his words that way.

The Dems reject a generous DACA deal and fight the wall and border force they supported under Obama. They want the hispanic vote and with open borders new votes. They do all they can to pull black voters away…Trumps a racist, white Supremacist homophobic misogamist……..

As I mentioned above go for the man and not the ball has been their tactic all along……aided and abetted by the upper echelons of FBI the DOJ and the CIA……..

The race card is the last throw. Can’t beat him….Make Trump unelectable……Boycott his supporters businesses Boycott gyms……Hound them out of restaurants…..cold shoulder them off the guest-lists in Hollywood……Fail to condemn Antifa’s  violence and demonstrations outside senators houses calling for the leader of the Senate to be stabbed…….

Make it as hard as possible to openly support Trump

Trump is no more or less racist than any of his peers….He’s an equal opportunities political attacker…..Black, white, male, female, gay or straight you punch he’ll punch back harder …….

With the media and google effectively being wings of the Democratic party how he’s resisted being brow-beaten into submission is almost heroic.

He loves his country…….I find him refreshing in that he’s trying his best to deliver on the promises he ran on……For a politician that’s as rare a rocking horse s**t.   

Ron Nasty: makes post criticizing Trump’s policy inconsistencies

Wigwam: completely sidesteps this by complaining about how Dems don’t criticize his policies

Seems like you’re more interested in spouting talking points than actually addressing what other people said

This morning I’d written a much longer reply that was timed out and after over an hours work I  frustratingly lost it all…. My post above was a potted ‘potted’ history which I stopped at Reagan I’d originally brought it up to the present day……but I’m not making an excuse as I think some of the criticisms of me from all of you above would have pertained none-the-less. I’m aware of the futility of my endeavour and the resistance I’m facing.

However, 

My point was not to sidestep merely to point out that over history both parties have exchanged the black and white cowboy hat and have played the race card. It’s almost forgotten that the Dems were the party of the KKK and black allegiance to the democratic party is nowadays a given and the party considered racist at its heart is indeed the Republicans. I think I successfully made the point that that wasn’t always the case and the answer isn’t that simple. I thought reminding people of that contributed to my point that  both parties cynically exploit race divisions. The Dems are currently whipping up race hysteria but not in my opinion out of any genuine concern because I don’t see evidence of its actual existence. If Trump is a racist he sucks at it, as his policies have advantaged all of the minorities.

It’s merely a game to the Dem’s. I firmly believe there’s no virtue in it……They have to find a way to defeat Trump……History will show they want to achieve this by fair means or by foul…. It’s politics!

Let’s see what the report into the origins of the FISA report has to say. I doubt the left wing media will be paying it much attention. 

I may be guilty of ‘spouting’ Kaniffee… in your eyes…….I’m just giving an opinion that I see as reasoned and un-conditioned by groupthink. I have no dog in this fight it’s purely an objective view.

Quarryman you make some good points….I actually used the quote from 50 years ago in my original post…(interesting that you decry my post for being set in the irrelevant past and then use a quote from before most of you were born). In Thai we would say: (‘Waa da kow Ineow ben eng)…You say one thing but do another.

I don’t try to argue either party is the more virtuous…..They will both fight each other for public support by any means at their disposal. That fact seems to be beyond anyone else’s comprehension.

Trump says some stupid stuff……He gets full credit for that….The good things he says or does are just written off and brushed aside with no credit whatsoever.

As a lone voice supporting him here I know how he feels…….

Ah well that’s life sometimes. 

I think there’s certainly some truth in the above 

I have to say the quality of the 20 or so Dem candidates is woefully poor……It’s as though someone somewhere scratched their heads and said ‘Find me 20 candidate worse than Hilary’

I can only see any of them getting votes would not be out of merit but purely out of hate for Trump.

The Hole Got Fixed said

I said yesterday and I say it again today…

I hate to say it but I do think that this has descended into arguing for no real reason. Obviously there are members on here, myself included, who feel strongly about the matter, but it’s at a point now where no one will change anyone else’s mind.

I’m worried that before long, it’ll get uncivilised.

Would anyone mind if we move on from this argument that seems to be going around and around in circles?

  

  

Knowing I’m farting against thunder ….I’ve tried twice to move on….Writing  a longish post about Hong Kong, (which I’ve little interest in) but if others, including board administrators can’t move on, I won’t either….. Just how I’m made.

I’ll have a look in in the morning and see developments.