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2.03am
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17 December 2012
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Again, @The Hole Got Fixed, she doesn’t! She is a constitutional Head of State. Look at is this way, at the moment you have a Head of State that you don’t pay for. If you become a Republic, you will need to introduce a way to decide on a Head of State, decide whether they have a political role or are symbolic, and pay the bills for them.
Seriously, when was the last time a UK monarch dictated to Australia that they could or couldn’t do something?
There is always an argument for a Republic, be it here or there, but there has to be serious thought to the kind of Republic and the role of Head of State, and while for us it might save us some money, for you it would increase what you spend on government.
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The Beatles Bible 2020 non-Canon Poll Part One: 1958-1963 and Part Two: 1964-August 1966
2.03am
26 January 2017
Offline Absolute monarchies are horrible. Dark Overlord’s ideal nation would quickly devolve into serfdom, a dangerous societal structure full of starving peasants and murderous thieves. When one monarch controls a nation’s laws and finances the royal family and other lords are the only people with wealth and power, and they often killed people to ensure it remained that way back in the day.
To be frank, i’ll take 2 terms of Trump in the oval office over 2 months of having a King.
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2.30am
Moderators
27 November 2016
Offline Ron Nasty said
Again, @The Hole Got Fixed, she doesn’t! She is a constitutional Head of State. Look at is this way, at the moment you have a Head of State that you don’t pay for. If you become a Republic, you will need to introduce a way to decide on a Head of State, decide whether they have a political role or are symbolic, and pay the bills for them.Seriously, when was the last time a UK monarch dictated to Australia that they could or couldn’t do something?
There is always an argument for a Republic, be it here or there, but there has to be serious thought to the kind of Republic and the role of Head of State, and while for us it might save us some money, for you it would increase what you spend on government.
Sorry, very poor wording on my behalf. What I meant to say: Our head of state is 15000 km away, which is really kind of stupid. Yes, we have a governer-general in place of the queen, but really? Can’t we find someone who actually lives here?
Gee, I dunno… which wars we need to fight in?
Well, as far as I can see, the government doesn’t actually spend anything on anything (at least where I live), so we may as well spend it on someone who actually lives here.
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2.39am
Reviewers
17 December 2012
Offline Well, if you take the Vietnam war, as an example, @The Hole Got Fixed, the British wouldn’t touch with a bargepole, and were firmly against, while it became Australia’s longest running war. The Queen did not say no to Menzies’ decision to take Australia into that abomination. I would suggest that there has been no war in recent history that it has not been the decision of your elected representatives to take part in.
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The Beatles Bible 2020 non-Canon Poll Part One: 1958-1963 and Part Two: 1964-August 1966
3.31am
19 January 2017
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Dark Overlord said
Good point, i still wish that the US had a king or queen in a constitutional monarchy with parliament and a prime minister like the UK.
Why would you wish this @Dark Overlord?
As mentioned, constitutional monarchies have no political powers and basically only exist for ceremonial reasons. In the UK this is based on many hundreds of years of tradition. Now the US did have a monarchy, but do bear in mind that this was well over 200 years ago and prior to the American Revolution . The US therefore has no real tradition of monarchy, so who would become king or queen?
Regarding the political frameworks of the US, why would you prefer a parliament and a prime minister? Every country has it’s own political frameworks which are purposefully designed for the needs of that country. Briging back the American Revolution , the founding fathers created a constitution with the ideal of creating a new form of Government that was different to the one used in Britain. The question should be how can systems around the world be improved, which is a subject for another debate.
@The Hole Got Fixed Yes the monarchy is based thousands of miles away but as mentioned it has no influence on how Australians live their lives. Now some Australians may well want to become a republic, but is this a widely shared belief? Plenty of people in the UK debate this issue and to be honest i’d say i’m on the fence.
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3.55am
Reviewers
17 December 2012
Offline Though, of course, @Flyingbrians, on the US situation, there is the argument that Trump would never have been interested in the Presidency were it only a figurehead role with no political power, while there was no chance of him putting in the time to become the leading Republican on the Hill; whereas Obama, the Clintons, the Bushes, even fecking Sarah Palin, were actually politicians, all of whom could – and did – rise within their party whether you loved or hated them.
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4.39am
Moderators
27 November 2016
Offline Ron Nasty said
Well, if you take the Vietnam war, as an example, @The Hole Got Fixed, the British wouldn’t touch with a bargepole, and were firmly against, while it became Australia’s longest running war. The Queen did not say no to Menzies’ decision to take Australia into that abomination. I would suggest that there has been no war in recent history that it has not been the decision of your elected representatives to take part in.
Well, during WWII, you told us to not bother with the threat of Japanese invasion in 1942, and to instead come to your aid. And I won’t touch WWI and the Boer war, because they’re not recent. After the idiocies of WWII, we gave up on Britain, really (and now follow USA with wars)
Flyingbrians said
@The Hole Got Fixed Yes the monarchy is based thousands of miles away but as mentioned it has no influence on how Australians live their lives. Now some Australians may well want to become a republic, but is this a widely shared belief? Plenty of people in the UK debate this issue and to be honest i’d say i’m on the fence.
So my argument is, why bother if it has no influence? Get rid of it! I reckon at least 60% – 65% of Australians support some form of republic. I certainly didn’t know it was debated in the UK. How much coverage does it get?
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4.57am
Reviewers
17 December 2012
Offline You actually followed the US in WWII, @The Hole Got Fixed. Roosevelt and Churchill decided on the Europe first policy. It was actually Hitler’s biggest mistake of the war. Directly after Pearl Harbor, because Japan were an ally, Hitler decided to declare war against America. Had Hitler not done that, it would have been difficult for Roosevelt to resist American calls to make the Pacific campaign the priority, but because he did it allowed Roosevelt to say that Europe was the priority, and to fight on one front at a time. Remember, the British suffered as much in the Pacific campaign as the Australians.
Would Australia really have fought the Pacific campaign without the US and the UK, while they were fighting on the European front?
EDIT:
And the leader who said he would have a referendum on replacing the Queen with an Australian Head of State, Bill Shorten, lost the last election, which shows how high on the list of priorities it is for the Australian public at the moment. I believe there will not be a serious move until the Queen’s death.
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5.03am
19 January 2017
Offline The Hole Got Fixed said
Flyingbrians said
@The Hole Got Fixed Yes the monarchy is based thousands of miles away but as mentioned it has no influence on how Australians live their lives. Now some Australians may well want to become a republic, but is this a widely shared belief? Plenty of people in the UK debate this issue and to be honest i’d say i’m on the fence.So my argument is, why bother if it has no influence? Get rid of it! I reckon at least 60% – 65% of Australians support some form of republic. I certainly didn’t know it was debated in the UK. How much coverage does it get?
I doesn’t get much coverage in the mainstream media, but there are some vocal republicans. With that being said, I expect that polls show that support for the monarchy is high in the UK.
As for Australia, it appears that people are roughly 50-50 on the issue. Look at this polling data since 1970.
The monarchy is retained for tradionalist and ceremonial reasons and i’d argue that they pull their weight. Also bear in mind that the UK benefits hugely from tourism as a result of peoples love of the royal family. Australia is a different question, so I’d understand why republicanism was stronger there – as with other Commonwealth nations.
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5.28am
Moderators
27 November 2016
Offline Ron Nasty said
You actually followed the US in WWII, @The Hole Got Fixed. Roosevelt and Churchill decided on the Europe first policy. It was actually Hitler’s biggest mistake of the war. Directly after Pearl Harbor, because Japan were an ally, Hitler decided to declare war against America. Had Hitler not done that, it would have been difficult for Roosevelt to resist American calls to make the Pacific campaign the priority, but because he did it allowed Roosevelt to say that Europe was the priority, and to fight on one front at a time. Remember, the British suffered as much in the Pacific campaign as the Australians.Would Australia really have fought the Pacific campaign without the US and the UK, while they were fighting on the European front?
EDIT:
And the leader who said he would have a referendum on replacing the Queen with an Australian Head of State, Bill Shorten, lost the last election, which shows how high on the list of priorities it is for the Australian public at the moment. I believe there will not be a serious move until the Queen’s death.
Well… we definitely would have fought on the Pacific front, because if we didn’t, we would have been captured by the Japanese. Remember, starting 19th February 1942, for the following (something like) 62 days there were (something like) 262 air raids (I can’t remember the exact statistic.) So the threat of our country was and always will be more important than an ally.
*May I just say now before I get accused: I have nothing against the UK, or the queen. I just don’t think Australia should be so dependent on them, as we are perfectly capable of moving apart.
The reasons why Bill Shorten lost were:
a) he has a low approval rating, and many who agree with his policies still voted against him because he’d be a hopeless leader
b) immigration was the major issue last election, and his stance that we should be more humane wasn’t popular
c) Rupert Murdoch said to vote for Malcolm Turnbull, so that’s what all of the old folks who can’t make up their mind did (voting is compulsory here, which is good… most of the time.)
Flyingbrians said
I doesn’t get much coverage in the mainstream media, but there are some vocal republicans. With that being said, I expect that polls show that support for the monarchy is high in the UK.As for Australia, it appears that people are roughly 50-50 on the issue. Look at this polling data since 1970.
The monarchy is retained for tradionalist and ceremonial reasons and i’d argue that they pull their weight. Also bear in mind that the UK benefits hugely from tourism as a result of peoples love of the royal family. Australia is a different question, so I’d understand why republicanism was stronger there – as with other Commonwealth nations.
Ah, ok, thanks! I would also expect the same thing, after all, I haven’t ever heard bad things about the queen from the UK.
That’s very interesting… I’d say 70% of those who I know support being a republic. But, I guess statistics are always true (did you know that 74% of statistics can be made up on the spot?)
Fair enough. I’m not saying that they don’t pull their weight: the opposite. But really, apart from tourism, what else does the UK get out of it? I’ve never got the answer to that question, and I’d love to know the answer. I think New Zealand also thinks the same way, but with less support.
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5.59am
19 January 2017
Offline The Hole Got Fixed said
Well… we definitely would have fought on the Pacific front, because if we didn’t, we would have been captured by the Japanese. Remember, starting 19th February 1942, for the following (something like) 62 days there were (something like) 262 air raids (I can’t remember the exact statistic.) So the threat of our country was and always will be more important than an ally.
*May I just say now before I get accused: I have nothing against the UK, or the queen. I just don’t think Australia should be so dependent on them, as we are perfectly capable of moving apart.
The reasons why Bill Shorten lost were:
a) he has a low approval rating, and many who agree with his policies still voted against him because he’d be a hopeless leader
b) immigration was the major issue last election, and his stance that we should be more humane wasn’t popular
c) Rupert Murdoch said to vote for Malcolm Turnbull, so that’s what all of the old folks who can’t make up their mind did (voting is compulsory here, which is good… most of the time.)
Flyingbrians said
I doesn’t get much coverage in the mainstream media, but there are some vocal republicans. With that being said, I expect that polls show that support for the monarchy is high in the UK.As for Australia, it appears that people are roughly 50-50 on the issue. Look at this polling data since 1970.
The monarchy is retained for tradionalist and ceremonial reasons and i’d argue that they pull their weight. Also bear in mind that the UK benefits hugely from tourism as a result of peoples love of the royal family. Australia is a different question, so I’d understand why republicanism was stronger there – as with other Commonwealth nations.
Ah, ok, thanks! I would also expect the same thing, after all, I haven’t ever heard bad things about the queen from the UK.
That’s very interesting… I’d say 70% of those who I know support being a republic. But, I guess statistics are always true (did you know that 74% of statistics can be made up on the spot?)
Fair enough. I’m not saying that they don’t pull their weight: the opposite. But really, apart from tourism, what else does the UK get out of it? I’ve never got the answer to that question, and I’d love to know the answer. I think New Zealand also thinks the same way, but with less support.
Interesting question and to be honest this is debatable. When I say that they pull their weight, I mean that they are actually quite hard working and they do a lot of things like charity work etc. I think the main thing that a lot people get out of the monarchy is a sense of national pride. I’d argue that the United Kingdom has a very strong patriotic tradition, and this is reflected in support for the monarchy. People just like tradition and the royal family are a key aspect of that. So yes, apart from tourism and a few other things like charities, it’s the symbolism of the monarchy that people love. This is the same in other countries, like Spain for example.
I have no real objections to the monarchy to be honest. The only aspect of it that i’m not keen on is it’s preservation of aristocracy and the fact that members of the royal family are elevated above ordinary people at birth. I think an aristocracy would probably exist without them though.
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6.05am
Reviewers
17 December 2012
Offline Way off, @The Hole Got Fixed, their were 97 Japanese sporadic air attacks on Northern Australia across 1942-43, the biggest of which was the attack on Darwin on 19 February 1942, involving 242 Japanese aircraft. Nothing compared to the Nazi air raids on the UK, which we fought off alone.
And much as you can suggest that Australia would have fought the Pacific campaign alone, the facts show that they didn’t. A strong enough defence force was left behind to defend Northern Australia, but the rest were sent to Europe because Australia realised they would at the least need the Americans, and the Americans were the deciding factor in the Pacific war when it was fought.
As to Shorten, my point was the Republican movement wasn’t strong enough to make the difference. The Brexit effect was enough to Cameron elected to a majority Government in 2015, and to allow Theresa May to just about scrape together a Government with the DUP’s support this year. Without Brexit, she most probably would have lost.
And, not to be picky, but the Queen has a capital Q when referring to an individual, as we are in this conversation.
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6.18am
1 November 2013
Offline 
Im the UK, the royal family makes them loads of money.
6.22am
19 January 2017
Offline Starr Shine? said
Im the UK, the royal family makes them loads of money.
We know that people from other countries love the royal family, so we make the most out of it.
I can guarantee that most people who travel to the UK visit Buckingham Palace at some point.
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6.33am
Moderators
27 November 2016
Offline Ron Nasty said
Way off, @The Hole Got Fixed, their were 97 Japanese sporadic air attacks on Northern Australia across 1942-43, the biggest of which was the attack on Darwin on 19 February 1942, involving 242 Japanese aircraft. Nothing compared to the Nazi air raids on the UK, which we fought off alone.And much as you can suggest that Australia would have fought the Pacific campaign alone, the facts show that they didn’t. A strong enough defence force was left behind to defend Northern Australia, but the rest were sent to Europe because Australia realised they would at the least need the Americans, and the Americans were the deciding factor in the Pacific war when it was fought.
As to Shorten, my point was the Republican movement wasn’t strong enough to make the difference. The Brexit effect was enough to Cameron elected to a majority Government in 2015, and to allow Theresa May to just about scrape together a Government with the DUP’s support this year. Without Brexit, she most probably would have lost.
And, not to be picky, but the Queen has a capital Q when referring to an individual, as we are in this conversation.
Wow, I’ve been fed ‘fake news’. My deepest appleogies, I thought it was much, much more.
But if we hadn’t sent those forces to Europe, the situation in the Pacific could have been very, very different, what with a much stronger armed force.
That’s true. But it was really the only thing going for him (he’d be my second preference, after a minor party, and that is the trend with a lot of left-wingers: ditch Shorten and go for The Greens, as they have similar policies with a better leader.
I’m sorry, thanks for the correction. I’ve learnt quite a few things today, that’s one of them..
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8.16am
Moderators
Members
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20 August 2013
Offline As an American, I enjoy the British Royal family. I have been to Buckingham Palace twice and Windsor Castle once. I keep a little Corgi doll on my desk at work.
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8.25am
19 January 2017
Offline Ahhh Girl said
As an American, I enjoy the British Royal family. I have been to Buckingham Palace twice and Windsor Castle once. I keep a little Corgi doll on my desk at work.
I’ve never been to Windsor Castle, even though I live in England. Is it worth going to? I’ve heard it’s pretty amazing 
I’d recommend Hampton Court if you like your Henry VIII and tudor history.
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8.41am
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Members
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20 August 2013
Offline Hampton Court is on my list for my next UK visit.
I thoroughly enjoyed Windsor. I took the guided tour first and then had time to wander around by myself.
The views from parts of the castle grounds are awesome too.
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9.24am
Members
18 March 2013
Offline It was nice of Queenie to lay a wreath at the Garden of Remembrance which is a memorial for those who died fighting British rule.
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